PC: Alt-Congress of Vienna (failure of Prussia)

[EasternRomanEmpire]

This is implying the Austrians doesn't yield to Britain's demands prior. And again, Britain's desires are in the west; they're only able to effectively intervene in Poland & Saxony because their most pressing desires had already been consented.

I doubt they will oppose an Austrian return, Austria had the territory for a century and it never was a threat to Britain.

And Austria is more busy in Belgium and Italy to object what is happening in Poland & Saxony, right? You can't have it both ways.

As I said I doubt Belgium is a major problem and Austrian ambitions in Italy aren't the main problem at the Congress, while you're risking a major war in Polish-Saxon crisis you won't bother that much with Venice being Austrian.

It's exactly what they want. Britain doesn't have to directly position itself on the continent and a friendly nation now owns the most existential threat to the British isles. Nothing about an Austrian restoration would calm the minds of Britain.

How is Austria a hostile power to Britain? In the last century they've almost always been allies with the exception of the Seven Years' War, but Austria has never been in a position to threaten the British isles so I don't see how this is an existential threat.

 

[OxSpace]

As I said I doubt Belgium is a major problem and Austrian ambitions in Italy aren't the main problem at the Congress, while you're risking a major war in Polish-Saxon crisis you won't bother that much with Venice being Austrian.

You're missing the point and completely undermining Britain's concerns here.

I doubt they will oppose an Austrian return, Austria had the territory for a century and it never was a threat to Britain.

How is Austria a hostile power to Britain? In the last century they've almost always been allies with the exception of the Seven Years' War, but Austria has never been in a position to threaten the British isles so I don't see how this is an existential threat.

Austria's relationship with Britain isn't the problem, it's their incapability to defend it. An Austrian restoration is a restoration of a half-ass presence in Belgium. The existential threat is the area falling back into enemy (French) hands.

 

[EasternRomanEmpire]

Austria's relationship with Britain isn't the problem, it's their incapability to defend it. An Austrian restoration is a restoration of a half-ass presence in Belgium. The existential threat is the area falling back into enemy (French) hands.

You can work on preventing French expansion, it's not like the Netherlands could've prevented France from taking the territory without outside help either.

 

[TrickyApe]

You can work on preventing French expansion, it's not like the Netherlands could've prevented France from taking the territory without outside help either.

That's a good point. There were no good options for protecting the Southern Netherlands so I don't know that Britain would be opposed to Austrian rule, if for some reason Austria had wanted to return.

The Netherlands was weak and an economic wreck in 1815 after enduring the Continental System. Its army was distrusted because of the high proportion of former Napoleonic officers and men. Even the stability of the restored House of Orange was an unknown quality and Britain's plan to marry the Prince of Orange to the Princess of Wales fell through fairly quickly.

The solution was to build the "Wellington Barrier", an extremely expensive line of forts that looked backwards to the situation of a century earlier, which itself had never really worked. The money was found and the forts built, but nobody was ever able to resolve the problem of manning them, since the Netherlands couldn't afford nearly such a large army. The best that could be worked out was a plan that hoped Prussian troops could move in quickly in an emergency.

Of course the whole system fell apart in 1830 when the Belgians decided they didn't like being part of the Netherlands anyway. It's hard to imagine Austria being less effective in keeping the area out of French hands.

 

[OxSpace]

You can work on preventing French expansion, it's not like the Netherlands could've prevented France from taking the territory without outside help either.

The difference is that the Netherlands can mobilize quicker and actively thwart the French. The Netherlands has much more to lose if Belgium falls than Austria.

 

[Aisha Clan-Clan]

https://www.alternatehistory.com/shwi/No%20World%20War%201%20-%20Cultural.txt

https://www.alternatehistory.com/shwi/Return%20of%20No%20WWI.txt

The POD of austria winning out in Vienna and being the one to unite germany leading to a no WWI seems like a possible longterm result.

Edit: Added a follow on discussion

 

[Fulano]

Was the Bavaria-Belgium deal considered at the Congress of Vienna?

No, but I was talking more about a possible move if Austria accepted Prussia getting all of Saxony. After all, Saxony got more land in the Rhine thanks to them not getting all of Saxony as they originally wanted. If they get Saxony, I don't think anyone would oppose to Austria getting all of the Belgian lands, plus some lands in the Rhine. With this, a possible Bavarian-Belgian exchange could be possible either in the congress of a few years after it.
Although another problem was that Britain saw the Wittelsbach as being "too friendly" to the Bourbons, so there is a chance of them vetoing the deal. Veto that the Prussians would join, if only to spite the Austrians.

Further Austria is primarily in Baden

I guess you are right. I thought Further Austria was closer to Bavaria, but I think the post-Napoleonic maps skewed my view.