Blue Skies in Camelot (Continued): An Alternate 80s and Beyond

Speaking of tv shows in TTL and not to derail this conversation but would would the soap operas in Blue Skies be like? I ask because my mum watches them and has often made me watch them to. Ironically we ended up liking the opposite shows to each other: mum likes Bold and the Beautiful and Young and the restless while I prefer General Hospital and Days of our lives. I also have a soft spot for Dynasty and Falcon Crest. Apparently my grandmother was OBESSED with Dallas and Knots Landing back in the day too hahah.
So if anyone on here likes soap opera what changes (if any) do you think there would be? Either characters, actors or plots?

Edit: When I say soap operas I'm referring to the American ones only. I know there are several popular soaps in the UK but for the purpose of this conversation I'm talking about just the American ones.
 
Speaking of tv shows in TTL and not to derail this conversation but would would the soap operas in Blue Skies be like? I ask because my mum watches them and has often made me watch them to. Ironically we ended up liking the opposite shows to each other: mum likes Bold and the Beautiful and Young and the restless while I prefer General Hospital and Days of our lives. I also have a soft spot for Dynasty and Falcon Crest. Apparently my grandmother was OBESSED with Dallas and Knots Landing back in the day too hahah.
So if anyone on here likes soap opera what changes (if any) do you think there would be? Either characters, actors or plots?

Edit: When I say soap operas I'm referring to the American ones only. I know there are several popular soaps in the UK but for the purpose of this conversation I'm talking about just the American ones.
That's one area that I think would stay the same. For shows like Dallas I don't think Butterflies would affect it much. others I'm not sure
 
I hope no one finds me weird for this, but I've just started thinking about what Norman Lear would probably say about The Amos Show in a reflective interview ITTL since @Uniquely Genius suggested that he'd be involved in the development and creation of the show, and I think I've got an idea is anyone interested in hearing it? If not that's okay.
No genius, I still can't believe how my suggestion here would have "The Butterfly Effect" to replaced The Cosby Show IOTL now the So Have I Movement started earlier ITTL and put Bill Cosby, along with Woody Allen and Harvey Weinstein behind bars for good as 80's starts to roll in. And I can't even thank you enough for all the ideas you've done so far genius. With me being the root of this idea (which I think this right on the spot), now I got to be involved on this one genius for The Amos Show ITTL. Keep thinking genius, best work so far!
Lear: By 1982, I wanted to do something vastly different from what I had done before because at that point the sitcom genre was in trouble I mean I can still remember one tv expert declared that the television situational comedy was dead and I guess I wanted to prove that it wasn't. In thinking of ideas to do I at first thought about returning to my roots in writing for a blue-collar family the shows that I was working at the time were The Jefferson's and Different Strokes where the families were very well off in financial terms. One day I was getting back from a trip to New York and I took a limousine where the driver was African-American and he and I had some interesting discussions very enlighten discussions and afterwards I thought that would probably make a good show, that would follow a driver and his day to day trips and conversation with passengers. So I wrote a treatment for a show that focused on a driver and his wife who I don't know why exactly but I imagined her as a carpenter.

Well sometime after that I ran into John Amos who of course would go on to play Cliff Huxtable, and I told him about this Idea I had and he said something to the effect of "Norman you've a blue collar working African-American show with Good Times. Why don't you do a show where they're not like rich but they're upper middle class like say a doctor and a lawyer." So I thought about it and the more I thought about It the more I liked that Idea. It was at that point where I met up with Marcy Carsey and Tom Werner. They had of course left ABC and created sitcoms with their own company like Mork and Mindy, Three's company, and Welcome Back, Kotter, and their company was at that point in trouble and I told them the Idea that John gave me and they loved it and they asked If they could create with me and I said "Okay."

So we developed the script and originally back when I imagined the family as a blue collar it was just a husband and I didn't see kids involved but Tom made the point that with a big family there are so many stories we could tell so that's how the what started out as five but became six Huxtable children were born. We originally went to CBS they turned it down, ABC turned it down, which made us go to NBC and they loved the concept of the story but they said that they wanted a big name attached to it and my mind immediately went to John and I called him up and asked him if he would be interesting in playing the head of the family and he was hesitant for understandable reasons but after we talked for a while and came to some compromise he agreed and so NBC signed off and now we had a network and now we had to find the right Mrs. Huxtable and children.
That's what I got so far let me know what you all think.
You've done another brilliant idea genius, impressive!
I'm glad I always like to imagine what happens behind the scenes of famous TV Shows and with some of the shows on here that will be different due to the political environment of the 80's ITTL versus the 80's IOTL, sometimes I can't help but wonder and imagine what would be said.
It's going to be a lot different now that RFK is the US President ITTL genius.
Cool! Geez, now I'm curious to know what this version of Stranger Things would be like, which set in the 80's ITTL.
It's going to be a lot different as well genius. I first started watching that show on Netflix at the height of the Covid-19 Pandemic Lockdown in 2020. I've watched the first 3 Seasons for 3 days straight, then the 4th Season for less than a day combined genius.
 
No genius, I still can't believe how my suggestion here would have "The Butterfly Effect" to replaced The Cosby Show IOTL now the So Have I Movement started earlier ITTL and put Bill Cosby, along with Woody Allen and Harvey Weinstein behind bars for good as 80's starts to roll in. And I can't even thank you enough for all the ideas you've done so far genius. With me being the root of this idea (which I think this right on the spot), now I got to be involved on this one genius for The Amos Show ITTL. Keep thinking genius, best work so far!

You've done another brilliant idea genius, impressive!

It's going to be a lot different now that RFK is the US President ITTL genius.

It's going to be a lot different as well genius. I first started watching that show on Netflix at the height of the Covid-19 Pandemic Lockdown in 2020. I've watched the first 3 Seasons for 3 days straight, then the 4th Season for less than a day combined genius.
Thank you for such kind words and thank you for suggesting the idea of The Amos Show. And you're right the 80s are gonna be a lot different with Bobby as President and I'm here for it.
Also question for you and we'll for everyone really. Does anybody have an idea of what the actors that could portray the Huxtable Kids or Claire Huxtable? I know I suggested Vonetta Mcgee for Claire but after doing some research on her and her work on balxplotation films I don't think people would accept her as a sitcom Matriarch.
 
Thank you for such kind words and for suggesting the idea of The Amos Show. You're right, the 80's ITTL are gonna be a lot different with Bobby as US President and I'm here for it. Also I have a question for you and well for everyone really, does anybody have an idea of what the actors that could portray the Huxtable Kids or Claire Huxtable? I know I suggested Vonetta McGee for Claire, but after doing some research on her and her work on balxplotation films, I don't think people would accept her as a Sitcom Matriarch.
You're welcome genius, now let's get this show work! Alright then genius, Vonetta McGee is out of the picture. So we're still going to keep Phylicia Rashad as the Sitcom Matriarch or anyone else genius?
 
You're welcome genius, now let's get this show work! Alright then genius, Vonetta McGee is out of the picture. So we're still going to keep Phylicia Rashad as the Sitcom Matriarch or anyone else genius?
What the heck yes let's keep Phylicia Rashad. Let's face it there's no one more perfect to play Claire Huxtable then Phylicia Rashad and the chemistry may be different between her and John Amos then what it was between her and Cosby but you know that may not be such a bad thing. So yeah let's stay with her and I had a thought how about for the oldest son in the Huxtable family how about Joseph c Philips the guy who played Denise's husband In OTL?
 
Hey @Uniquely Genius with The Amos Show going two more years than the Cosby Show, as the person who first came up with the Idea of The Amos Show how do you imagine the type of finale that the show would need to have in order to end on a high note?
 
Now that i think about it, and i know this is an unpopular opinion that is contraversial

but the 80s in OTL was a corporate wasteland with the 90s being very institutional (at least outside of pop culture) all of which led to the eventual downfall of western society after 9/11 which was built up after the fall of the USSR

i glad the 80s is better ITTL with its progressive nature thats less like what the 80s was in OTL and more like the 80s was in japan or the UK

hopefully this will lead to a better 2000s with no 9/11 and a better 2010s without all the strict regulations, laws and other crap that led to the downfall of late gen Z and gen alpha in OTL

if both this timeline and geronimo ends with covid not happening among other things i could list then these will be the greatest modern timelines to live in of all time
 
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Now that i think about it, and i know this is an unpopular opinion that is contraversial

but the 80s in OTL was a corporate wasteland with the 90s being very institutional (at least outside of pop culture) all of which led to the eventual downfall of western society after 9/11 which was built up after the fall of the USSR

i glad the 80s is better ITTL with its progressive nature thats less like what the 80s was in OTL and more like the 80s was in japan or the UK

hopefully this will lead to a better 2000s with no 9/11 and a better 2010s without all the strict regulations, laws and other crap that led to the downfall of late gen Z and gen alpha in OTL

if both this timeline and geronimo ends with covid not happening among other things i could list then these will be the greatest modern timelines to live in of all time
I don't think this is a controversial take though that's just me. I'm also glad the 80s will be better. Just imagining the progress that an RFK president will do for America and the world from the advancement for human rights, to a whole bunch of progress that was not able to happen in OTL.
 
Hey @President_Lincoln do you think with RFK President the Equal Rights Amendment could be passed? I think you've talked about it already but I can't remember
The Equal Rights Amendment has already been passed ITTL. Here it was the 25th Amendment, ratified in 1971. The 26th Amendment, also ratified that year, lowered the voting age to 18 nationally. The 27th Amendment, ratified in 1973 in the wake of President Romney's assassination, set the modern protocol for Presidential succession.
 
The Equal Rights Amendment has already been passed ITTL. Here it was the 25th Amendment, ratified in 1971. The 26th Amendment, also ratified that year, lowered the voting age to 18 nationally. The 27th Amendment, ratified in 1973 in the wake of President Romney's assassination, set the modern protocol for Presidential succession.
Thank you I remembered readings about it in the last thread but I couldn't remember it. I have to Go back and read that part. Thanks for answering.
 
As we enter the 1980s, one of the things that is memorable about that decade is the US-Japan Trade War. During this period, there was great concern about the trade imbalance between Japan and the United States. Japan was exporting an overwhelming amount of goods to America, resulting in the depletion of the American manufacturing industry. American jobs and products were being lost. Consequently, many Americans initiated "Buy American" campaigns in response to this issue. This movement included acts of Japan-bashing, where individuals resorted to both verbal and physical demonstrations of their dissatisfaction and anger towards Japan. In certain areas, such as auto manufacturing centers, people were seen smashing Japanese vehicles on the streets using baseball bats.

My question, Mr. President @President_Lincoln , is: will this OTL trade war manifest itself in TTL? And if it does, do you think that the TTL RFK administration and the Democratic Congress will be more protectionist and economic nationalist than the OTL Reagan administration, given the continued survival of the New Deal coalition and the unions remaining a vital power block within the Democratic Party?
 
Hey @President_Lincoln I just watched a commercial for The Color Purple and it got me thinking about how it will go ITTL. Do you have an Idea for it? Like will the 1985 movie still be directed by Spielberg or another Director and will the relationship between Celie and Shrug Avery be much more explicit than it was in OTL since the United States is on the path to being much more progressive in the 80s?
 
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As we enter the 1980s, one of the things that is memorable about that decade is the US-Japan Trade War. During this period, there was great concern about the trade imbalance between Japan and the United States. Japan was exporting an overwhelming amount of goods to America, resulting in the depletion of the American manufacturing industry. American jobs and products were being lost. Consequently, many Americans initiated "Buy American" campaigns in response to this issue. This movement included acts of Japan-bashing, where individuals resorted to both verbal and physical demonstrations of their dissatisfaction and anger towards Japan. In certain areas, such as auto manufacturing centers, people were seen smashing Japanese vehicles on the streets using baseball bats.

My question, Mr. President @President_Lincoln , is: will this OTL trade war manifest itself in TTL? And if it does, do you think that the TTL RFK administration and the Democratic Congress will be more protectionist and economic nationalist than the OTL Reagan administration, given the continued survival of the New Deal coalition and the unions remaining a vital power block within the Democratic Party?
In short, yes. I believe that some kind of "trade war" between the US and Japan was more or less inevitable by the 1980s, barring some sort of major intervention in the issue. While it's obviously a complicated issue, I believe that RFK and the Democrats will probably need to shift left in favor of (at least some) protectionist policies in order to really secure the continued support of labor unions in their base. In all likelihood, Kennedy will try to pursue a middle course between the extremes - Fair Trade - emphasizing support of higher tariffs for particularly vulnerable industries while pushing for lower tariffs on other goods. This nationalist, populist position, if adopted, will probably make Kennedy popular among union men and women, but it will also make him an easy target for the Republican Party, who will no doubt claim that RFK and the Democrats are "driving up prices" and "bringing back inflation" by opposing free trade. If this is the course that the Democrats take in the 80s here, I can see the GOP going hard into neoliberal economics, deregulation, and free trade to differentiate themselves. Electorally, this probably helps Democrats in the Midwest/Rust Belt but hurts them in the South and emerging Sun Belt.

Hey @President_Lincoln I just watched a commercial for The Color Purple and it got me thinking about how it will go ITTL. Do you have an Idea for it? Like will the 1985 movie still be directed by Spielberg or another Director and will the relationship between Celie and Shrug Every be much more explicit than it was in OTL since the United States is on the path to being much more progressive in the 80s?
I do have some basic ideas for the film adaptation ITTL. While I feel that Spielberg probably did the best he could, he was also probably right in his initial assessment that he didn't have the personal connection with either the source material or the deep South to really do a film adaptation justice. Even with a (somewhat) more progressive 1980s here, this is still the 1980s we're talking about. If you're going to have the relationship between Celie and Shug be more explicit, I think you're going to limit the mass-market appeal of the film somewhat. That is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, I'd argue that Spielberg's decision to minimize their relationship was a mistake; I've read that he later regretted it. But that will require that the studio who takes on the film be open to that idea. Maybe its producers and Alice Walker can sell the project to Warner Bros. (or whoever buys the film rights) as a "prestige picture". This version would (ideally) be helmed by an African American filmmaker, or at the very least, someone to whom the novel means a great deal. Its box office could be slightly lower than IOTL (due to backlash to the openly lesbian relationship). On the other hand, the controversy could lead the LGBT+ and African American communities to rally around the film and really drive turnout to go see it. I'm open to suggestions beyond this, of course.
 
In short, yes. I believe that some kind of "trade war" between the US and Japan was more or less inevitable by the 1980s, barring some sort of major intervention in the issue. While it's obviously a complicated issue, I believe that RFK and the Democrats will probably need to shift left in favor of (at least some) protectionist policies in order to really secure the continued support of labor unions in their base. In all likelihood, Kennedy will try to pursue a middle course between the extremes - Fair Trade - emphasizing support of higher tariffs for particularly vulnerable industries while pushing for lower tariffs on other goods. This nationalist, populist position, if adopted, will probably make Kennedy popular among union men and women, but it will also make him an easy target for the Republican Party, who will no doubt claim that RFK and the Democrats are "driving up prices" and "bringing back inflation" by opposing free trade. If this is the course that the Democrats take in the 80s here, I can see the GOP going hard into neoliberal economics, deregulation, and free trade to differentiate themselves. Electorally, this probably helps Democrats in the Midwest/Rust Belt but hurts them in the South and emerging Sun Belt.


I do have some basic ideas for the film adaptation ITTL. While I feel that Spielberg probably did the best he could, he was also probably right in his initial assessment that he didn't have the personal connection with either the source material or the deep South to really do a film adaptation justice. Even with a (somewhat) more progressive 1980s here, this is still the 1980s we're talking about. If you're going to have the relationship between Celie and Shug be more explicit, I think you're going to limit the mass-market appeal of the film somewhat. That is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, I'd argue that Spielberg's decision to minimize their relationship was a mistake; I've read that he later regretted it. But that will require that the studio who takes on the film be open to that idea. Maybe its producers and Alice Walker can sell the project to Warner Bros. (or whoever buys the film rights) as a "prestige picture". This version would (ideally) be helmed by an African American filmmaker, or at the very least, someone to whom the novel means a great deal. Its box office could be slightly lower than IOTL (due to backlash to the openly lesbian relationship). On the other hand, the controversy could lead the LGBT+ and African American communities to rally around the film and really drive turnout to go see it. I'm open to suggestions beyond this, of course.
I mean the controversial nature of the film could also drive the box office up you know you could have all these right wing ministers and officials speak out against the film and you know it will make people curious as to why they're talking about this and it will make people go see it. I agree that Spielberg did the best he could but I feel that he wasn't the right person to direct the film, as good as a director he is, that story, that subject matter, I think you're a right it needed someone who had a real connection to the story and the south. If I could make a suggestion how about Spike Lee direct it? He didn't start directing until 1986 in TOO but he could make his directorial debut with The Color Purple ITTL.
 
I mean the controversial nature of the film could also drive the box office up you know you could have all these right wing ministers and officials speak out against the film and you know it will make people curious as to why they're talking about this and it will make people go see it. I agree that Spielberg did the best he could but I feel that he wasn't the right person to direct the film, as good as a director he is, that story, that subject matter, I think you're a right it needed someone who had a real connection to the story and the south. If I could make a suggestion how about Spike Lee direct it? He didn't start directing until 1986 in TOO but he could make his directorial debut with The Color Purple ITTL.
That could be interesting. I was thinking either Lee or Charles Burnett. Burnett would have made a couple of feature films by 1985 ITTL, but these were all low-budget independent films. The Color Purple would be his first "studio" film. I think both could work well.
 
That could be interesting. I was thinking either Lee or Charles Burnett. Burnett would have made a couple of feature films by 1985 ITTL, but these were all low-budget independent films. The Color Purple would be his first "studio" film. I think both could work well.
Ohh I like Burnett He was born in Mississippi so he would really feel a connection probably to the deep south as written in the story. One of my hopes is that ITTL The movie is more honored than it was IRL I mean you know because the movie wasn't as good as it could have been I still think Whoopi and Oprah deserve Oscars for their portrayal in those movies. Hopefully ITTL the Academy will grow a pair and give the movie it's due's despite the obvious controversy In my view some of the best movies are the one's that have controversy
 
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